After hearing complaints of sexual harassment and assault in Second Life (SL), on July 25, 2018, SurfWatch asked the question, does sexual harassment and assault exist in a virtual environment? We invited people that had experienced it to share that experience with us.
We received our answers via anonymous responses when several women and noted experts told us, yes, it does, posted September 19. The subject opened up a conversation about reality vs. virtuality, about disrespect of boundaries and abuse of power in any world, and even resulted in angry name calling and a sim ban by two men in the SL surf community, both in positions of power and authority at the time. One of them sent me a Facebook message, "metooIdon'tgiveafuck#".
Truth is, not everyone will give a fuck. Some people use virtual worlds and the anonymity primarily to have sexual encounters, to harass others, to behave in ways they wouldn't dream of behaving in RL or that might even be illegal in RL, to find a way to abuse power in SL that they have no hope of having in RL. The whole purpose in opening up this conversation is to encourage discussion, to think about whether the same rules apply in virtuality as in reality, and maybe to help others heal whether they are the hurting or the ones causing the hurt.
Per www.Gadgette.com's posting in August 2015, "Finally the Police are Taking Unsolicited Dick Pics Seriously":
"...an unwanted dick pic is just as bad as someone standing and flashing at you in the street. It’s still a violation, still unsettling and uncomfortable for women, many of whom have been victims of unwanted sexual contact before. There’s this weird idea that because it’s online it’s somehow totally fine – there’s no direct threat, sure, but it’s still deeply unnerving. There’s this sinister undertone, a sexually aggressive thread that runs through messages like that, whether it’s from someone you know or not."SurfWatch has left our door open for women and men to dialogue. We were recently contacted by two women wanting to share their experience on this topic. Both women were willing to come forward and provide their names, photos, details and proof about the experience. We have redacted the name of the perpetrator who is the same in both of these cases. Here are two women's stories:
Kanjena Sweetleaf:
It was the end of summer, early September. I was surfing, as usual, lost in my own world, when I received an IM (instant message) from REDACTED. I had just been thinking about him, too, wondering how he was getting on as I hadn't heard from him or seen him for a while. I always enjoyed our chats. I had been out of SL for most of the summer.
Previously my chats with REDACTED were often about surfing in RL (real life). I'd told him about my favourite beaches and suggested he visit them. He picked up the subject in the IM and said he had visited some of the places I'd suggested. He told me he had been up all night, on a 'bender' as we say, implying that he was drunk, but his patter was very lucid and there was no typos or anything else to suggest he was very drunk. We talked about a recent heatwave and then about some of the beaches he'd visited, and then he talked about the very fresh coastal air unique to a certain location. He started telling me how the fresh air had made his dick grow bigger and fatter. I was taken aback, bemused by this sudden twist in the conversation. Then he sent me a picture to prove the 'fact'.
I didn't ask to see it, I was completely uninterested in his penis and was already feeling uneasy about the shift in the topic. I was not amused in the slightest but played it down, caught between thoughts, a confusion of 'WTF!' and 'is he serious?'. I turned the conversation back to RL surfing and eventually the conversation ran its course. I logged out then and didn't return that day.
The next day I was not long online when I received an IM from REDACTED. He was immediately apologetic and remorseful. I had already turned this over in my head and had decided that it must have been a foolish mistake. He confirmed this and said he was really drunk and didn't know what he was doing. I cut him some slack and said that it was not unusual for people to become exhibitionists when they are drunk, and as I've never been prudish about nudity, I contextualised it this way. I was being kind as I considered him a friend and a good guy. But I was also masking my personal unease and I had this question 'why me?' running through my mind. The conversation ended amicably, despite my inner awkwardness, and I told him that I wouldn't mention it to anyone else.
The apology didn't really convince me or make me feel any better and I wondered to myself if the friendship was really worth anything, but I had been wondering the same about many friendships that had turned sour, usually with men who wanted something I wasn't prepared to give.
I didn't come back to SL much after this incident until late October when I started surfing in SL again. I was in a state of reticence and distrust in general. I wrote on my profile 'SL terrifies me' which was true, I was scared of people and their actions.
One day, in conversation with a friend, I asked about various people and was told that there was some tension in the surfing community which had been piqued by a post on Surfwatch about #metoo in virtual worlds. I then discovered that some girls had made allegations of harassment. There were no details given. I told my friend 'me too'. This led to further conversation with more details, where I found out that REDACTED had done the same thing to other girls, he created a pretext in conversation which led to him sending dick pics. I got a pic titled 'my d 6' so he obviously has a few, pics that is, not dicks.
This was a liberating moment for me and a sad realisation. The excuse of him being drunk was a tactic, as was the grooming of the subject, me, towards the topic of his penis. I was angry then, angry that the friendship was nothing more than a means to his gratification, that I had let him off the hook because I thought he was a drunken fool, angry that he had done this to others and that his remorse was an act, I had been played and played again.
I'm speaking out now because I want him to stop this. His actions are sexual abuse, it goes beyond harassment, it's deliberate manipulation and then an act of uncalled for sexual misconduct. There are laws against this; it is criminal behavior.
I'm left wondering, would he do this in RL? How far would he go to get his kicks?
He could have got off the hook, too. He almost did, I was prepared to accept his apology and to consider him a fool, but when I found out he had done this to others then I knew I had to stand up against it. He's very fortunate really, he's in a virtual world, he can still get away with it without any serious legal repercussions.
One more thing. It is a disgusting feeling to be used this way, to be forced into a sexual situation that I didn't ever ask for or suggest, to be used as an aid for sexual gratification like I am just a character in his fantasy world, like I am less than human.
To REDACTED: Have a word with yourself, man, your apologies are hollow but you should apologise to your past and future selves, to the women who matter in your life, you've fucked up the now, it's up to you to change.Selene Aruba:
In November 2018, I received a message in world telling me to take off my panties and get ready, or something to that effect because I do not want to quote specifics. At that time, I paused and messaged him back and told him he had the wrong chat and basically he shrugged it off as well as I did thinking he indeed knew it was the wrong chat window. He apologized and I thought that was that.
(graphics removed)
Shortly thereafter, I woke up to a message on Facebook Messenger from him (who I thought was a Facebook friend) of his RL (real life) dick pick. When he sent his obscene pic in Messenger, I was not amused or entertained and actually felt upset at the fact that he thought this to be funny or cute.
At that point I didn’t bother to reply and reached out to a friend that I trusted to explain what had happened. The combination of being in shock and not knowing what to do is what made me reach out to someone that knew the both of us, since we hang out within the same circle. This for me is quite upsetting being that rumors spread quickly and the fact that when I did come to speak to my friend that I trusted, she had informed me that I was not the only female that has been harassed by this person and not only that but that she herself was being jaded for speaking up.
Whoever has any doubts I have proof and have no problem sharing. As a community we should stand for what’s right rather then sweeping it under the rug.
If you have a #metoo experience you'd like to share with SurfWatch, please contact Tauri Tigerpaw. Our door is always open.
Quote reference:
https://www.gadgette.com/2015/08/14/finally-the-police-are-taking-unsolicited-dick-pics-seriously/
For additional insight and discussion, see:
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2019/jan/08/what-makes-men-send-dick-pics
https://everydayfeminism.com/2016/01/why-men-send-dick-pics/
https://www.yourtango.com/experts/laurel-house/why-guys-send-unsolicited-dick-pics-one-night-stand
https://broadly.vice.com/en_us/article/8xvy8v/why-do-men-send-dick-pics
Posts
59 comments:
Not so much Aloha here. We all know who this is. My personal experience with him was never a dynamic I appreciated. I thought him to be an immature individual who just drank too much, lost his filters and and all sense of human dignity. Dude, Yo, get off the grid and get some help.
Before any #metoo articles appeared I was aware of his kook behavior, however when I heard of his "every dude has a right to get laid in SL" mentality my thoughts immediately went to the women who are his "friends", one of whom I know only too well. All I can say about that is shame on you. Shame on the women who don't call him out on his behavior, because it indeed sends a message to men. That message is that SOMETIMES it's just okay to sexually harass and even assault women. Because in a virtual world it's funny? Shame on you all, this is never appropriate.
The SLSA is about to award this smarmy piece of shit the Sportsman Award?
And to you, you know who you are, not to admonish him in the way we are all so painfully aware that you are able and should, fuck you.
Not so much Mahalo,
JT
Not much Aloha indeed.....
Unfortunately this knuckleheads disrespect is not limited to women. He seems to have very little respect for anyone at all including himself.
Like many Before him, once all his bridges are burned he will simply create yet another alt and start over.
Giving him ANY Award other than "Griefer-Dickhead" would therefore also be disrespectfull to the entire surfing community.
/V
Shame on anyone that covers up for this prick, he should be removed from the SLSA imediatley and have all his awards striped , conduct like that MUST not be tolerated
If this person receives any further accolades or awards from the SLSA I will remove myself from all membership including my Hall of Fame membership. Why? Because it means that SLSA has failed to protect the integrity of the sport in SL. I urge you to join me in protest as well. This is an issue for men and women alike. Shame on you SLSA. Shame on you.
Alcohol is no excuse for his actions. There are many precedents in law when a sexual abuser has tried to use substance abuse as part of a plea for diminished responsibility, the success of such a plea has been dependent on whether the prosecution can prove a methodology to these actions. In this case there is a definite methodology, a flasher might claim they acted on impulse but this virtual flasher has a number of pics ready made, a method of manipulating a conversation to this outcome, and a method of attempting to shift the blame for his abusive behaviour onto his alcohol abuse. This is somebody in total control of his faculties and his actions.
Aside from the disgust I felt at seeing the image he sent, and the betrayal of friendship that still hurts, I am also annoyed at his insult to my intelligence. It's really annoying when some people objectify me to a level where they dismiss my actual personality and my intellect to the degree where they presume I don't remember things that they have told me previously about themselves. This guy told me he had never surfed in RL, yet in our last conversation when he dick-bombed me, he also told me he had surfed at a particular beach in RL, a beach where they hold the O'Neill Cold Water Classic, where a 14 foot swell is an average day. This is not a beach that any beginner could surf, I know, I lived there for 4 years. That lie and that casual presumption that I am incapable of recall and judgement is almost as insulting as the sexual victimisation.
These guys are actually sick. A friend experienced exactly the same case past week and we all knew the guy who did this to her as he was one of us. Just because of guys like these, good men have to suffer. The proverb "All Men Are The Same" is never true, but still there are a lot of women that think like that.
Kanjena Sweetleaf, ALoha. This guy is so fucked up most of the time he doesn't remember the lies he tells. I had him on my "list" for a short time with some pretty strange conversation. He is no RL surfer.
I was a member, a supporter and a participant in the SLSA for many years before he came along and there was always some kind of aggro going on, but none the likes of his. I left because of him and his self proclaimed saviors of the SLSA. After I left, on more than a few occasions, he would arrive at Fogbound where Megs and I were, right in front of us with one of his groupies, get in MY girl's IM, request stupid songs dedicated to me and generally just be annoying personally to me and mine.
I completely agree with the sentiment that he should be removed from the SLSA, his awards be taken and just ban his ass. There is no due process here, we know what he does and continues to do. He is a pox on the surfing community and has been since he arrived as a noob surfing every board on every wave like he'd been doing it for years. Myself, Connie and Mick all commented on it when we saw him surfing as a four month old in SL on our sim.
Stand up SLSA, for once, DO THE RIGHT THING! Don't let this smarmy MF be the face of the surfing community any longer.
Okay, so that was a rant. Really sick of this asshole for a very long time.
Mahalo,
JT
Amen JT
I would only add that if you are waiting for the SLSA to do the "right thing"....don´t hold your breath.
They have long known of this dirtbags antics so expecting any action now is a long shot at best.
/V
Firstly, I could not "keep quiet" about this whole post either. This is a bit ridiculous.
I am a woman and have been sexually harassed and abused in REAL LIFE. This is all bullshit and a waste of everyone's time and seems to have a personal vendetta. We see dicks on tv - it's 2019.
As for posting the screenshots and this whole discussion, to me, that seems just as much harassment. Not to mention that anything can be taken as unwanted in SL..........
I do not condone what the person did, but.....
Get a pic you don't like? Say no thanks and move along... if it continues.. THAT is harassment.
I agree V. They (THE SLSA) are drafting their response about KM now. It will lead with something like, "While we do not condone this behavior, the incident occurred on the FaceBook platform and there is nothing we can do."
Fuck that...he is who he is every where he goes and by doing nothing the SLSA will be complicit. Please show me wrong.
Their "rules" should transcend in this incident and do what is just right. He knows as a director what can and can't be done to him.
You are a living piece of smarmy excrement Marley...have another drink and celebrate.
JT
Anonymous said, "This is all bullshit and a waste of everyone's time and seems to have a personal vendetta. We see dicks on tv - it's 2019."
Just because you say so eh? We see dicks on TV? Seriously? Nobody should be forced to see someone's junk unsolicited. People are different and how they respond to things. How about I send you one to your personal IM? Are you wearing a little thong? Like you would just toss it without complaint? Bullshit.
You do not get to decide what is someone else's waste of time. You made a comment right? Why waste YOUR time? Vendetta? You smack of hypocrisy...posting his screen shots are harassment? You do not get to dictate how another person is supposed to feel, go pound sand and have a drink with your buddy. You are entitled to your own opinion...but that is all it is.
JT
Ridiculous?
So your logic is....send unsolicited dick picks to women whom you have set-up in conversation but.....only ONE time?
Then, if they are offended they should just "move on".
As long as you don´t do it twice to the same woman (THAT would be harassment) it´s all good?
Sounds to me like your one of his enablers. Your logic is part of the problem.
/V
Exactly one of his enablers V. One of the many women around him that send the message that this behavior is no big deal. She doesn't condone it though...sounds so trumpy.
JT
To the anonymous person who calls the article bullshit.
Firstly, nobody named the perpetrator, I insisted on that in my case, and if people recognise him then that's because they know of his actions, apparently it's no secret.
Did you not comprehend that this keeps happening, that he's done this many times to different women, is THAT not the harassment you talk of? Repeat offending.
You try to claim authenticity because of RL experience. I can claim that REAL LIFE authenticity too and perhaps others affected by this SL abuser can, maybe even the perpetrator, that's worth considering before firing off a comment isn't it?
If this is so then stand up and recognise it for what it is, it wasn't a picture of a cartoon cock, and it's not the actual image that defines the abuse, it's the coercion, the betrayal of trust, the grooming, but you should know that surely?
You say this is a waste of time, well it's not a waste of my time.
You say you don't condone it but you choose to victim blame too, be true to yourself and talk about it, nobody else is hiding anonymously here.
Firstly, I'd like to state that my opinion of the people involved in this is unbiased, to a point. I have one dear friend who was caught up in it, and has been deeply affected. I do not know anybody in the surfing scene in Second Life; I'm commenting as a friend, a man, and most importantly, as a human being.
Harassment is harassment, regardless of the social platform, or how 'real' it is. Because it is not in person, does not necessarily lessen the impact that the harassment can have on the victim. I know that my friend has lost a lot of confidence in Second Life as a platform, those who reside within it, and her interactions online with people in general. Her reaction is not irrational or overblown; it is a human response to a vile and unacceptable exchange with somebody she considered a friend. She even gave him the benefit of doubt, despite suffering, until it became apparent that he was a serial offender. How anybody can call this ridiculous is utterly beyond my comprehension.
Hiding behind, and blaming substance abuse for repeated harassment, is a tangible trait of a serial offender. A person whose short-term 'thrill' matters much more to them than the comfort and happiness of their friends, colleagues and those they converse with. This is not a person who should be in a position of power or influence.
Again, I do not know the person we're discussing, I'm merely stating an opinion with hope that the SLSA (an association I have no prior knowledge of) apply common sense, and hold themselves responsible to both SL ToS, and their duty of care to the social scene they hold a position of influence over.
There are victims here; people who have suffered to meticulously planned and sinister actions of a serial groomer. This person is not a one-time offender who can hide behind an intoxicated state. They know exactly what they are doing, and they should feel the consequences of their actions, as those who have fallen victim to them have. There is only one right conclusion here.
To the person in question: Own your actions and do the right thing – step away. You have hurt and angered people, and you have done this for a cheap kick. If nothing else, you need a ‘time-out’ and to ‘find yourself’. I do not know the struggles of your life, or why you find yourself in this position, but your actions are not of a happy and good person. They are of a selfish person with total disregard for others.
Regarding the question of a 'vendetta'
This guy was supposed to be a friend, someone I trusted, trust being a vital part of the abuse, abuse being more than just the action of sending a dick pic, I'm talking about an abuse of trust. Anyone with experience of sexual abuse by a familiar knows that trust is the hinge of the abuse and that trust is shattered by the abuse.
I'm not part of any surfing scene, I keep to myself, I don't talk to many people in-world about the surfing scene, ironically the perpetrator was one of the few people in that scene who I did talk to. I have no interest in any beefs or dramas in the scene unless they affect me.
I don't care what the SLSA do or don't do, I want him to consider his actions and change himself, that is the least I could want for someone I feel compassion for, despite his abuse of my trust and friendship. If he was convicted of this in REAL LIFE then he would be placed on the Sex Offenders Register for his entire life, that would affect everything he does thereafter. In SL he has the opportunity to cease this behaviour and reassess his relationships, it's his choice.
Sure showing how respectful men can be with all those posts....... O.O
Sure showing how respectful men can be with all those posts....
Part 1 of 2 (hopefully)
Firstly, for those few that are dissing SLSA in this. I invite the readers to please search for them in the forum of SLSA. You will find that these 3 men are repeat offenders of harassment to many, many, many people who they have created drama with in the past. They are no longer SLSA members and have vowed to make it fail. Literally each one of them has quit the SLSA because they thought different members were harassing them at different times and they wanted all those members banned. See the pattern here? Feel free to look it up yourself. Furthermore, one of these men repeatedly made jokes to the female competitors that if they show their tits, they'd get a better score, but of course that's dismissed as a joke and the females should just accept that. No mention of how it might trigger them. So for those saying you don't get to dictate how a person should react, please mention that to one of the more vocal people in the group.
Through Kanjena's own admission, she is not a member of SLSA either and therefore, this is ONE member of a group who did a terrible thing. Not an abuse of power, as we are trying to claim here.
Secondly, sending a dick pic is gross. I'm a female and get them constantly in my messenger and quite frequently in SL. Yes, they're annoying and intrusive, but yes, you do move on. Any female that's been in SL for any amount of time has been subjected to them. For the victims of actual sexual assault, to compare the two is pretty insulting, as most females can attest. But nonetheless, they should not continue. Acting like they are the equivalent, is not fair though. Unless we want to say that any female that lifts her shirt and shows her boobs at the beach or a rock concert is also a violator and rapist. (To say that would be body shaming though, wouldn't it?)
What we are failing to acknowledge in all our hot-topic-keyword-throwing-around is what kanjena is actually trying to say. She felt this person was her friend and when he turned it sexual, it hurt her feelings and she began to think of herself as a sexual object to this person. I, too, have felt this and it really is hurtful. Being angry and hurt about it, is completely understandable.
Part 2 of 2
A female spoke up here and said she was offended that it was being compared to a sexual assault and you all laid into her and accused her of blaming the victim. As a court official, I can tell you that plenty of women use these things as a revenge tactic and to never speak up and give the other side, or to shame the person that does, takes away from the real dialogue that needs to take place here, which is of course what surfwatch is claiming is their motive.
To say ppl will only recognize this person because they're a repeat offender is ridiculous and lacks a basic understanding of social media. You're angry, he hurt your feelings, I get it.. But to use words like "groomed", come on.. that's too far. Maybe he actually did value your friendship and made an unwanted (and vulgar) attempt at a sexual relationship.... that's not grooming, that's just being dumb and unsmooth, but grooming is "works to separate the victim from peers, typically by engendering in the child a sense that they are special to the child and giving a kind of love to the child that the child needs. " Can you honestly say that is what happened? Because it seems more like a bad date where the guy was just a sleeze and you went home early.
Let's be careful with the words we throw around and the way we do it. This is a real dialogue that needs to happen. I'm sorry these women got shaken up over it. I am sorry that it triggered something emotional in your past. I have always felt like SL was dangerous for those ppl. But "abuse of power" can only take place when the person has actual power, which they did not in this case. And sexual assault, though they're trying to include "dick pics" in that, they're pretty clear about posting these pics as being "revenge porn" so let's be careful where we cast our stones.
Firstly? Anonymous said, "You will find that these 3 men are repeat offenders of harassment to many, many, many people who they have created drama with in the past. They are no longer SLSA members and have vowed to make it fail."
Your post is a LIE! Neither myself, VW or Rayz EVER vowed to make the SLSA fail. I suggest YOU LIE TO DEFLECT and protect your friend. Name yourself! We are signing our names at the bottom. I suggest if you are not willing to do the same then don't post. I'm pretty sure I know who you are and you would protect Marley no matter what he did.
I was involved with drama in the SLSA because there was so much bullshit from comp to comp and I cared about what was going on. I would suggest you have not been around that long in the SLSA and have listened to folks and read heated posts from the forum. If what I did was harassment, and some thought it was, I apologized to them personally for feeling that way. I also believe I had a word with Rayz about comps and "tits".
JW was obsessed with harassing me as a judge and a person, repeatedly went after me and spread lies to the community about how much "power" I had over everyone. He's since admitted to me he was wrong and that he didn't know why he did it. I can post the IM. Cierra is WELL aware of this and had my back for a lot of what went on. Being a judge in the SLSA was something I enjoyed doing and I was repeatedly harassed and there are now "rules" in play because of it. Everyone I ever worked with judging a comp agreed I was fair and consistent so don't go there when you try to defend your mates with bullshit.
Harassment is not the same as civil discourse and to equivocate here, that any goings on in the SLSA forum are equal to what Kris Marley has done to people ALL OVER THE FUCKING GRID is bullshit.
JT
To clarify, I am an ex-member of the SLSA.
In British law this 'abuse' is classed as a sexual offence, for example if a guy coerces a person into a situation and then get's their dick out and starts masturbating, that is technically, legally, classed as sexual offence and is punishable by law. This also applies to 'virtual' scenarios, in most cases proof of a random dick pic would not alone secure a conviction, what has to be proved is intent and threat with evidence demonstrating Modus Operandi, evidence of repeat offending secured by witness testimony would also count as proof towards conviction. This is how serious it is, regardless of my feelings, this is criminal action.
I feel concerned with the comparison between what happened to me and someone exposing themselves in a non-sexual scenario, British Law agrees with my concern to the degree where it would be completely within my rights to sunbathe naked on my property, just as it is completely acceptable and legal to swim naked in our coastal waters. There is no comparison between someone sunbathing topless on a public beach and someone entrapping someone else, with false pretences, in order to show them a picture of themselves masturbating.
What upset me is the betrayal of trust, that is true, and thanks to all who have taken time to read and understand this, but that doesn't negate the seriousness of what happened, I want him to realise this, he's fortunate that this is a virtual world and that I am not vindictive. I could have ARd him or even gone to the Police, that is within my rights and there is a great deal of interest in virtual offences so it would not necessarily be ignored, especially regarding SL ToS (which the SLSA supports on it's own website), but instead I acted as a friend and let him off the hook until I found out he had done this to others.
To address the elastic logic of the commenter who states that 'We see dicks on tv - it's 2019'
Imagined scenario number 1.
Mother: 'Dear daughter of mine, I know that he coerced you into a situation, exposed himself and masturbated, I understand that, but, we see dicks on tv - it's 2019'
Imagined scenario number 2.
Mother: 'Dear beloved son, I know the arresting officer has charged you with sexual offences including coercing a subject, then exposing yourself and masturbating but why didn't you tell the officer that we see dicks on tv - it's 2019.'
Again, thanks for reading and understanding, peace, love and healing to all.
To Part 1 of 2:
Well said...much better than I was able to articulate.
To Vw and JT:
I'm fairly sure I'm not an enabler... as I mentioned, I was sexually abused as well as harassed in real life (the reason for my anonymity). It was by men in a position of power. Do you really think calling an abused woman an "enabler" is remotely respectful? You have zero idea what I went through, and show no compassion. Not to mention the attempt at insulting my intelligence and logic just because I do not agree with you, as well as all the name calling above. Completely disrespectful to women and in general.
I too, have examples of both of you being disrespectful and harassing in SL. Your opinions on this subject are invalid to me at this point.
I am neither part or in any meaningful way connected to the surfing scene, indeed I have only ever been to such a sim twice in my life.
However, such behaviour simply cannot be ignored and as such I admire the article enormously.
Any attempt to sweep such matters under the carpet and ignore the importance should shame those that attempt to do so.
When these Anonymous Part 1 of 2 hopefully comment(s) start saying 'who they are' I might read what they have to say. In the meantime if you cannot identify yourself then do us all a favor and go play your silly games somewhere else.
Sincerely,
valium lavender
(who has been sexually assaulted in Real Life and Second Life and it was no laughing matter then and it is not one now)
I have watched this unfold from the side and have tried to be mindful of the feelings and emotions of all parties involved. I don’t think anyone here is condoning or even remotely saying that what has happened is any way acceptable or right. Quite the opposite. What transpired cannot be accepted as proper conduct.
Name calling, bashing, admonishing, or just disparaging words are counterproductive to this entire ordeal and take away from the issue at hand. That is not limited to people but to groups as well. An organization has no bearing on the actions of an individual. A person can misuse power no matter the circumstance. Yes, the organization should be resolute in their stance and not accept behavior unbecoming of their beliefs. I can’t help but feel there is some predetermined bias being shown by certain responses that illustrate this is about more than the actions of one and about a group. That line of thinking is just as detrimental and masks the issue. The core of this is about the people involved, so let’s please not lose focus of that.
I’ve been in Second Life more than I care to admit and surfing for almost as long as I’ve been around. I have personally witnessed behavior unbecoming of individuals no matter their affiliation. This ranges from inappropriate comments about higher scores for exposing themselves to just blatant unwanted advances. We must all endeavor to be better people, to be above this.
We are all people. Part of being human is mistakes and failure. That is the human experience. We are all flawed including me. Treat everyone with love and compassion knowing that everyone is struggling here.
This chick called ME out and I missed it?!
But...by all means. Search my name in the forum: VW Sands. See if you can find a post with any drama and or bullshit. You´ll have to scroll a bit. My last post was probably in like 2013 -14 (?)
I left the SLSA before you were born chicka. I did so quietly and drama free. If I was a "repeat offender" it was for using "lol" to excess. Sue me. Since then and until this day I have never "vowed" anything other than having more fun with my friends.
None of which has anything at all to do with abusive behaviour. Using propaganda and lies while hiding your own identity to protect someone, anyone, that has no concept of consequence, no humility, no integrity and no respect for anything other than him or herself....that´s just sad. I guess I just don´t understand the the dynamic in play that causes women to defend men that abuse and betray.
Come to think of it....that may say as much about them (the women) as it doe´s the culprit (?)
/V
Additionally, you said, " Not an abuse of power, as we are trying to claim here." Let's address that shall we? I am aware of two occasions (one of which I watched personally and the second another board member reported) where KM banned people from the SLSA as a sitting director all by himself without even consulting even one other board member. That is exactly an abuse of power by a KNOWN predator of not just women, but people in general in SL. But that is NOT what any of this is about is it?
By allowing this POS shit to be the face and crowned prince of the SLSA, the SLSA while not complicit in the legal sense, however most certainly in a moral sense, is shameful.
You So, erm, Anonymous, coming in here and making all your nonsense noise about how it's "insulting" to compare RL sexual harassment to a dick pic sent on FB or SL, you don't get to live inside anyone's head but your own. Please just stay there. Go pontificate to your friends whom you elegantly manipulate without detection. Tell KM to come in here and defend his actions instead of hiding behind your lying posts here made to deflect from what what he DOES PERVASIVELY.
Peace,
JT
No offense people, but as far as I know, this comment section revolves...or SHOULD revolve around the harassment case as stated in the article above.
So far I've seen many a comment about #metoo, but certainly just as much, if not more about problems between people commenting here, problems within the SLSA and a lot of issues that quite frankly don't have anything to do with the harassment these two women have spoken up about.
I suggest you lot take your personal grievances and grievances with a group as a whole somewhere else and deal with it there. The focus right now should be on the sexual harassment within the #metoo subject and those directly involved. The last thing these two women, who so strongly and proudly spoke up about what has happened, need is this fighting to and fro between commentators, who, to be fair, have zilch to say about what should and shouldn't happen.
You're not the #metoo victims, THEY ARE and it should be their choice how things should proceed from here on out.
You got a grievance with the SLSA? Move it away these two women, one of whom has already stated she could care less about the SLSA, the other has not even mentioned the SLSA. Respect that.
Should the perpetrator be put straight, speak up and apologize, ofcourse. There's no one than can say what he did was right. It's a disturbing and horrible thing to do, we all know that.
Should the women who have been sexually harassed be guided and supported? Hell yes, I'd call that rather obvious.
But this bloody fighting about the SLSA and who did what shit when in the surfing community and who's the biggest dickhead of them all does not belong beneath a #metoo article on SurfWatch.
Resolving this issue within the SLSA is something that HAS to happen..ASAP,but it is something that can not be done HERE.
Kanjena obviously does not care what the SLSA does, all she cares about is that their assailant steps up and does the right by THEM!
We are here to tackle the sexual harassment. The empowerment of women to have the freedom to speak up about this and anything, if they so choose. To break the silence. To support the victims and to make sure this.....all of this....does not happen again.
And yes, I have used no names besides my own and Kanjena, really, we all know who everyone is and I refuse to get in an argument or a fight with anyone.
Leanne
Its pretty gross to be sending pictures of your junk all over but what is a billion times worse and more disturbing than that is to post the picture of someone else's junk online for the world to see; that's messed up. If you are personally not happy with people sharing pictures of there junk, think its wrong, and wish to make a statement about it then that's one thing, but it's another thing to call the person out and make it obvious who that person is. This was a poor attempt to make it seem like you were trying to hide this person's identity. The picture is literally right against his poorly blurred out profile picture when you could have just taken out the profile picture all together and just left the picture itself or not at all and what was said as an example. I may be wrong but I think this article was obviously made to target someone in particular and that's wrong and pretty sick. Good for you for making a statement on this topic but, seriously? have some respect and just stick to the story without the personal photographs, I may be speaking for myself here but I dont wanna see that ****.
At this point, if you don't sign your name, it's just blah blah.
I've not seen name calling. Please point that out. Enabler? tsk...
I agree with Leanne about this not being about the SLSA, however that's where he is,that's what he does all the while being a director and supposedly held to a code of conduct.
Anonymous came in and called this all bullshit. Speaks for itself.
She said, " Do you really think calling an abused woman an "enabler" is remotely respectful?" You defend him and are perhaps not due much respect.
"As a court official," A paralegal is not a court official.
As to perpetuating harassment on my part, yeah I own that, they probably deserved it. I never sexually harassed anyone or sent dick pics. I've never set up a woman to take advantage of her emotionally or other wise. Your opinions on the matter here mean nothing because YOU HIDE.
Look, he did what he did and it's deplorable. He should seek help. Instead he is defended and rewarded...THAT is bullshit
JT
I'll probably stop commenting now, I just wanted to say thanks again to those who have read and understood, some amazing comments here.
Particular sincere respect to those women who have told of their own RL experiences here, I totally empathise, I've been there too in RL, manipulated and assaulted by someone who took advantage of their position and then blamed their drunkenness.
This is why this episode caused me so much turmoil, it never leaves you, it's a lifelong process trying to deal with the effects and it hurts to see that it is so common too. It has been cathartic to express those feelings here, but this is not blaming 'the assailant' for anything that happened in my past, it's coming down hard on something in the present that can't just be swept away or ignored.
'Treat everyone with love and compassion knowing that everyone is struggling here.'
That is a beautiful sentiment, treating people with love and compassion doesn't mean giving them an easy ride if they have conducted themselves in a way that is damaging to others, but it does mean that they are also human and fallible and it's fair to try to appeal to that human soul to 'own your actions and do the right thing" even if it's futile it's the way I choose to live.
<3
Okay one more comment as I missed something I need to address here.
'it seems more like a bad date where the guy was just a sleeze and you went home early.'
That is laughable, to even put that idea out there is a low blow and for a supposed court official to make such a suggestion without evidence is legally contemptuous.
Here's a pretty solid description of adult grooming:
'Adult grooming is the adult equivalent to child grooming and applies to any behaviour where an adult is prepared so they unwittingly allow abusive behaviour or exploitation to occur later. The abuser typically befriends or builds a relationship with the victim in order to establish a relationship of trust'
I've told my story, this is exactly what happened. I did expect the counsel for the defence to suggest it was a bad date that went wrong and in all these comments I almost missed it.
I think its a bit too far to put the picture of his junk up for everyone to see with his profile picture poorly blurred out next to it, just saying. its not necessary to have the picture showing in the article and that's that. make a story on the topic, that's great but the personal picture, that's too far. PS, I will happily sign my name.
I Valium Lavender submit this comment;
The following comment by Part I blah blah, does not even makes sense.
"Secondly, sending a dick pic is gross. I'm a female and get them constantly in my
messenger and quite frequently in SL. Yes, they're annoying and intrusive, but yes, you
do move on. Any female that's been in SL for any amount of time has been subjected to
them. For the victims of actual sexual assault, to compare the two is pretty insulting,
as most females can attest. But nonetheless, they should not continue. Acting like they
are the equivalent, is not fair though. Unless we want to say that any female that lifts
her shirt and shows her boobs at the beach or a rock concert is also a violator and
rapist. (To say that would be body shaming though, wouldn't it?)"
Sexual abuse, harassment, violation is REAL no matter where it takes place, in real life or a virtual reality. The above statement could not have been written by anyone who has ever been raped or assaulted. Also, just because we are subjected to things in SL does not make it alright. We don't 'go along to get along' or do we? Cowards do maybe. I am sick of ignoring rape sims in SL; abuse in SL towards women AND men. I have had it really up to my ears in the lack of morality in SL. I stay because I have friends I adore in SL and I love photography here as my creative outlet. I have been thinking over the past few months about a project I could possibly do with my photography to make a difference in SL with regards to abuse of power in SL...and also in protest of rape sims. I find these things disturbing and I am tired of remaining silent. If anyone wants to join in and help me by all means contact me.
But in regards to this whole Kris Marley thing? He will disappear in short order. He will implode eventually because he is on a suicide mission with his lifestyle. I think he is a weak and sad person. He has no desire to help himself improve. That says a lot to me. He has learned nothing and still walks about as if he is God's Gift to SL. He also pursued me as one of his 'victims'. I was outraged but like so many decided I would give him another chance. He continued with his abuse until finally I had to mute/block, ban etc etc. and just pretend he does not exist for my own well being. We all make mistakes but good people learn and improve themselves from personal mistakes. We show remorse for anyone we hurt. That is what makes us different from serial killers. KM shows no such remorse or any attempt to learn and improve. Think on THAT!
Valium Lavender (Vally)
SLSA former Board Member and Hall of Fame Member (when it meant something).
People: At the end of the day, this is singularly about a sick man who pervasively harasses people (men and women) both sexually and emotionally in our little virtual world. It has nothing to do with what happened with anyone else five years ago or even last month. That's like ... those emails!!! These women wanted their story out there and we should all respect that without trippin' and blaming people for other things that just don't apply.
If you don't like that he was called out for it, so be it. To me that is as if you defend both he and the behavior. Maybe you don't like what he did and just disagree with how this was handled. Too bad. This is not about me, VW or anyone else's behavior as much as you would like to push that narrative on the world.
STOP THE DEFLECTION and HELP YOUR FRIEND. If I didn't disdain him personally I might have more compassion for him. I do feel really sorry for him and the fact that his friends have to come in here and fight for him. I understand people are talking to him and he reports to feel remorse...Step up and apologize Bro...get right and you'll find some peace.
Mahalo,
JT
Tyler, it's the Internet. You post your junk on the Internet... it ends up on the Internet.
Who does that? Kooks do that. Why do that? It's weird. I think if you post your junk on the Internet you deserve to have your junk show up anywhere.
Bottom line, don't be that guy. Think about it, it's pretty fuckin' weird.
A few thoughts:
1. Those of you who have a history of bad blood with the offender need to do a better job of not letting that detract from the issue. We get it, he is concentrated evil and needs to be marched through King’s Landing, accompanied by a person of some religious standing, who rings a bell and repeatedly shouts “SHAME.” I left out that he needs to be naked for obvious reasons.
At the end of the day, it’s not about one person and his repeated offenses against a multitude of women. It’s not about how he may have conducted himself as a board member of the SLSA. And it’s certainly not about his surfing style or whether he has ever been on a wave in RL.
This is about all of us and how our actions can affect other people more negatively and deeply than we may have considered.
2. There have been many requests to remove the photos. Some claim that their inclusion makes the post itself as offensive as the original acts that are being reported. Perhaps you missed the disclaimer at the top warning of graphic content. The victims did not receive any such disclaimer.
Others feel removal is warranted because they allow the offender to be identified. I personally would not want my junk on blast, even blurred, but perhaps this is the punishment that fits the crime. You want to share your dick pic with people who didn’t express an interest in seeing it? Well, mission accomplished. If the reports that the offender is actually feeling remorse are true, would this be the case if his identity weren’t known? Is this an effective deterrent? Will it result in other potential victims being spared?
3. The world is full of diversity. Everyone is different and is guided by a unique moral compass. There are also a myriad of reasons why people spend time in SL. It could be to enjoy the music scene, to build beautiful sims, to surf, to make friends, to find love, to get laid, to rape, or even to be raped. What is disgusting to some is kinky and erotic to others. One person’s standard sexual advance is another’s violation of trust and sexual harassment.
This is exactly the problem. Laws, Terms of Service, Rules of Behavior, and even common sense are supposed to help avoid the situations the post describes. They failed. Why? Is it merely a lack of enforcement and thus, deterrence? If so, why is enforcement lacking? Should the offending behavior be treated as a sickness instead of a crime? Does that excuse it? What is the cure?
I’m in no way defending the offender. I hope he learns from this experience and becomes a better person. I hope the victims are able to move past it and that the scars eventually disappear. I hope everyone learns that our actions matter in all lives, but if you are in SL, at least head to the sims intended for your kinks instead of using your “friends.”
Unsolicited peace and love to all.
well said anonymous whomever you are:
"I’m in no way defending the offender. I hope he learns from this experience and becomes a better person. I hope the victims are able to move past it and that the scars eventually disappear. I hope everyone learns that our actions matter in all lives, but if you are in SL, at least head to the sims intended for your kinks instead of using your “friends.”"
my only thing is I wish there were not rape sims in SL as it only perpetuates violence against women.
valium lavender
I didn't want to comment again but I need to address Ally McBeal up there with her suggestion that my experience was all a bad date. This suggestion, thrown in tactically to muddy the waters of course, has pissed me off somewhat.
The flaw in what will now be known as the 'Bad Date Defence' (did he suggest this?) is that I don't date in SL, I never have dated in SL. I can prove this too and provide character witnesses and of course, although I won't reveal chat logs as that goes against ToS, I can read them aloud or transcribe them if it comes to it. I don't think I am on trial here though despite this very shoddy attempt to shift some of the blame onto me.
A point I should make clear. On the day that this guy IMd me (out of the blue as we hadn't talked in months as I had been away from SL for months) I was surfing at Cloudbreak. For obvious reasons that are now clear to me after reading Vally's comment above, he was not even on the same sim as me.
"my only thing is I wish there were not rape sims in SL as it only perpetuates violence against women."
I agree with you, and there are other types of RP that I find equally disturbing. The way I process it is that both (all?) genders are participating with consent. It is really no different than a RL couple who likes to spice up bedroom time with a little pretend rough play. I may find it unappealing and in poor taste, but I'll take it over genuine abuse any day.
I don't want to take the discussion too far from the original topic, but I do feel that the use of SL to push personal boundaries and explore our imaginations in all areas is germane to the discussion. On the one hand, it gives us a relatively safe and anonymous environment to try things we would never do in RL. On the other, it desensitizes us, and the thrills we experience can become addictive to the point that it becomes difficult to remember that we do not all want the same thing, and the feelings and emotions experienced in SL are happening to a RL person. Consent matters in all lives.
Hello at all I am here for the first comment post, sorry for my bad english sometimes but i try to be corret more the posssible that i am 😁..
First on all, i agree every single word of Leanne and Tyler, and without defending nobody whatever people have done, but mention an organization like SLSA about these things is something of nasty and disgusting with all the respect. If someone have had problem with a certain people in another social network that i dont even know it (metoo etc..), i think there is always how to take measures against that kind of peoples, like the ignore button and the report thing (my blacklist in sl is more high than a max capablity of 3 sims jajajaja), so I can understand also the girls that they could have had troubles with certain people and they should use that things and finish definitively the "harassment chat", and be less like victims because we know in the world of social network we can meet every single people, from the more "clean angel" to the more "dirty criminal" or "dirty naughty" etc lol, so we cannot be surprised about these things, without justify nobody.
Mentioning an organization that is doing an hard work for let all us having fun with surfing in sl (and btw i am not a surfer rl too, i started to understand surf only thanks here in sl 😊), is really destructive, with all the drama that it going to created inside, and with this, sadly, they go there also the peoples that don't count nothing about the theme that we are talking about.
And about Tyler's post, i agree even his speech. There wasn't need to post the blurry image of him in this site and not even the image of his junk, that is really too much far and defamatory, like i have said first, you having troubles with certain "peoples"? good, the measures against these "peoples" exists in their social network's options. I am sad to say this, but there wasn't need to show that, if the offended girl was upset about it, was free to tell her story here but always "inside the lines" like we say, and i say all this without defending anyone that has done something offensive against other people.
In almost 5 years of sl (born in may '14) I have had seen of all the colours here, in all kind of sims and games, all kind of peoples "nasties" and "dirties", peoples "assholes", peoples that harassed me too, but i have always used the measures that exists in sl (blacklist, and if more heavy, abuse report), without "wave" all the story in another kind of sites or social network.
We are all humans here and we have our feelings, and in the whole world of internet we really need to take all our "precautions" for travel and make friendship on it 😋.
ILY
"
JT said...
Tyler, it's the Internet. You post your junk on the Internet... it ends up on the Internet."
Actually JT, it is very clear that it was sent PRIVATELY through a messaging app... not POSTED on the internet, that is what SW has kindly done for him instead.... Total BS.
Anonymous said, (this actually cracks me up) " Actually JT, it is very clear that it was sent PRIVATELY through a messaging app... not POSTED on the internet, that is what SW has kindly done for him instead.... Total BS."
Do you know what the Internet is? Every time you turn on your computer and go to your email, a PRIVATE messaging app or whatever, you are ON the Internet.
"A global computer network providing a variety of information and communication facilities, consisting of interconnected networks using standardized communication protocols."
Let me recommend the movie "Snowden" a story about Edward Snowden who worked for the National Security Agency.
https://mashable.com/2015/04/06/edward-snowden-dick-pics/#H1Z0mnl4VmqI
Edward Snowden: "Yes, the government can see your dick pics."
Someone said, it's 2019, we see dicks on TV. Nothing on a computer or phone is PRIVATE and THAT was my point.
BS? Get woke, every single keystroke and photo you think you are privately sending to anyone on any device that uses wifi ...lol...can be available. You think shit is private? LOL.
I get that it should have been private and how people don't like seeing it here. Actually, and for the record, I don't see his junk, it's blacked out. We don't even know if it IS HIS junk. Anyone can post junk taken from anywhere. If he was so fucking asinine to send this PRIVATE junk to someone who did not request it, want it or even understand WHY in the world he would send it, she should have sent it to authorities and reported his ass. Whatever anyone thinks about this SW article...this NEVER SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED IN THE FIRST PLACE...do you get that?
I agree we should stick to the topic at hand here as well. Many Anonymous posts have been made here to deflect away from how these women felt and what they experienced emotionally by his insensitivity and whatever inconsiderate state of mind he was in. They want to come in here and point fingers at other folks like this is some political campaign.
So, the SLSA comes into play because most of us posting here are in SL and this is a surf blog. Rayz brought it up that he should be stripped of his awards, VW basically concurred, so did Vally and I agreed. Former members mostly. Former for a reason. The SLSA doesn't step up to protect it's members from bullshit that may fall outside of their Constitution. So be it, I get it. KM is the FACE of this group and it's their call to proudly show him off as their champion. Cool, whatever. Keep watching this space for more captivating stories.
Mahalo,
MT
Actually, sending a dick pic to multitudes of women that have shown no interest in seeing it is a better definition of "total BS."
The only people who know whose fuzzy profile that is are his friends and those who read the comments where his name has been mentioned. Perhaps instead of attempting to do damage control, his friends could focus on helping him understand that what he has been doing is "total BS." If they don't feel strongly enough about it to do that, then perhaps at least convince him that sending unsolicited photos of his junk in a manner that identifies him is a bad idea.
The issue is way bigger than one offender or the brave victims who have chosen to say something and provide proof of his actions, but it seems that people are more concerned about what it means for the offender. Excuse me if I struggle to muster any sympathy or to pick up my pitchfork. Both sides are focused on the wrong thing.
This has happened. Similar occurrences with different offenders and victims happen often. It may not bother all of you, but it bothers enough that it is worth discussing. We can either try to turn this unpleasantness into something positive, or we can continue vilifying and defending one person, who may or may not have learned anything form all of this.
Just a short response to what I think is above. My "pitchfork" is well in hand because I've been on the shit end of his pitchfork too many times. Yeah, I'll take some cheese with my whine, put it on my pitchfork and shove it up his ass. I'm sick of hearing stories about this this guy for years (from day one...bully, bully and more inappropriate behavior stories) after my personal experiences with him. I am totally transparent regarding my loathing bias against him.
Having said that, I hope all women who have been victimized heal well and good, and that he finds it in himself to get help.
JT...not MT
Personally I think this discussion here has long outrun it's course. The same points are being said over and over...
Does he need to suffer the consequences of his actions? Yes
Is it a vile, disgusting, gross, rude, disrespectful, etc... thing to do? Yes
Does he need to step up and apologize to those he has harmed? Yes
Do the people who have suffered harassment at his hands and others (because, let's face it, it's not just him, this article is there to also open the way for others) need support and guidance and the freedom to speak up? Yes
Does this case need to be sorted within the SLSA as soon as possible? Yes
Is trying to smooth over what he did wrong? Duh
Does he need help from friends, family, professionals even to get back on the right track? Yes
Can we all agree that there have been things said here that are right, wrong and even seen as wrong when perhaps not meant that way? Yes
Has everyone made their point loud and clear? Obviously
The way I see it, the time for accusations and arguments has passed. We can continue villifying and arguing, but I think every part of this has been discussed at length. I have seen some wonderful comments above in all of this that I agree with 100%, I think it is now time to focus on the healing aspect. Talk to people personally in a respectful and dignified manner, send out any message you feel needed to those who CAN provide consequence, wether it is his friends or those in positions of "power" and hope (and even pray for some of you) that whatever the consequences that follow, that they are just and do right by the victims and those within the immediate circle affected.
This whole article above has not only served it's purpose for the two women who spoke up, they have had the chance to speak about what's probably been festering within them for a long time and they have been given the freedom to show their emotions and their heartache surrounding what has happened.
But, it has also opened the way to others, to show them that it is OK to speak up, that there is no need to hide and stay silent, that there ARE people willing to listen and guide and support. It may not be an immediate release for many, but they will KNOW .
And THAT, ladies and gentlemen, is the most important thing about all of this. It is not only to hate and rain judgement on ONE person, who, I'm sure will have to face the consequences in due course, but also, that those who have been suffering harassment, ranging from days, weeks to even months and years KNOW that they can have the RELEASE from their anger and hurt that they in most cases so desperately need.
All my love,
Leanne
Navy says:
After watching this for a bit, I cant help but to speak my opinion properly.
No, I haven't read each and every comment on here. No, I don't plan to... so I'm sure I won't address everything, please forgive me in advance.
Do I agree with this person's actions? No. Am I going to stand by my friend? Yes. That is who I am (and that is who many of us are, people who stand by their friends). I know this is not truly a bad person, and I know he does not deserve this kind of treatment from the comments section (I don't think I need to point out names).
We ALL make mistakes and have struggles and often need to re-evauate ourselves. This is the journey of life and how we grow. I feel that some of you should feel a bit ashamed of how you have conducted yourselves here (my personal opinion). I don't mean that as an attack, but as a nudge for reflection.
How can we EVER expect to become a real community if we do not band together and use our understanding and support rather than disparage others.
Having said the above, I also completely understand the need to speak up for what you feel is right. Does everyone have the same definitions of "right"? Of course not, and how can we ever expect that? However, saying what you feel is right does NOT have to include disrespecting others.
Now, a bit about me...
I have been through some things in my own personal life that are very hard to talk about and are directly related to sexual abuse.... some things that I cannot even think about saying right now without tears welling in my eyes. So, please, understand that this topic hits very close to home for me.
I have a huge heart and I truly care about people, even on Second Life. I work hard to give people a chance and to try to understand them. I find that this only encourages positivity in my life. Positivity is contagious and sparks great things.
I'm definitely not asking any women to pretend this didn't happen or to not feel offended/disgusted by the actions of my friend. He himself knows this was wrong and has already apologized on his own volition prior to any of this being posted. I do not see the need to further persecute him. He did not assault anyone, and to compare a photo to being sexually assaulted is simply incorrect. If you should disagree with that, please feel free to IM me inworld or fb to discuss further. I'm fairly confident you will agree that there is no way they are on par. I have also been sexually assaulted within Second Life (punched and "raped"), and although I will admit that experience did shake me, it simply cannot be compared to a real life sexual assault.
I agree with and support the #metoo movement fully, but I do not believe the way this has unfolded is right either. Everyone deserves more. xo
Every single person who has commented here, is right in someway shape or form. ALL of us are individuals and have our own core beliefs, what does or does not insult us, what does or does not offend us. I am in no way invalidating anyone who has or has not signed their names. The fact is we are all human and by that right we all suffer the human condition of being fallible, imperfection that dates back to the garden of Eden, if you are so inclined.
I personally have suffered abuse more than most know and do not condone abuse by any means. I have lived through it suffered emotionally for a very long time, got help and moved on. But guess what, people F**k up, how many of you can sit there and say you have never wronged anyone anywhere.
I know this person feels regret and is completely embarrassed by what has happened and is very hurt by what he has done. So yes i believe he has learnt a very valuable lesson. But I also will not abandon a friend at the lowest point of his life. Every single one of you has the right to speak up and either have a hate fest on this that or the other thing, or you can also realize we all mess up bad and hope to the heavens that it will be forgotten and forgiven at some point.
WE are all individuals and who are we to be judge jury and executioners, this should have remained between the individuals involved themselves and taken further legally if so inclined and dealt with in the RL realm if the victim was so personally offended.
I personally think that dragging it across a SL related surf blog is inappropriate. If you are so insulted and offended take to RL, and not put it in place where every single person who reads the blog then has to basically choose a side and let the war begin.
I support the #metoo movement as I am part of it, this is SL related and I come to SL to leave that outside of this medium. This is a, read the title, pleaseeeee, SURFWATCH blog and no where in that title do i see sexual harassment forum..
I hope those who support our friend will surround him and help him get through this and also help him to correct this behavior so he will not repeat it. For the people who have suffered at his hands, I will say sorry for him, because I know he does not know what to do to make this better for you at this time. For those who are just determined to vilify him and nail him to that cross, I hope that what has come to pass is enough for you feel satisfied with your efforts.
We are all so ready to tear each other down and ready to crucify at a moments notice, and that's what makes me believe humanity as a species is doomed. I for one, choose neither the high road or the low one, I will choose the path of peace, love and forgiveness...
♥♥♥ Shilow Carter
aka
Shi
Well I see Gandhi has spoken (Navy) so let's all forget about this whole mess and let the perpetrator off the hook rather than know for certain that he has taken responsibility for his actions. I want to know that he has. An Open Letter to 'his community' would be received well I think as long as he can provide information as to the actions he has taken to change his ways.
valium lavender (vally)
Just claiming my post.
I have watched this unfold from the side and have tried to be mindful of the feelings and emotions of all parties involved. I don’t think anyone here is condoning or even remotely saying that what has happened is any way acceptable or right. Quite the opposite. What transpired cannot be accepted as proper conduct.
Nsme calling, bashing, admonishing, or just disparaging words are counterproductive to this entire ordeal and take away from the issue at hand. That is not limited to people but to groups as well. An organization has no bearing on the actions of an individual. A person can misuse power no matter the circumstance. Yes, the organization should be resolute in their stance and not accept behavior unbecoming of their beliefs. I can’t help but feel there is some predetermined bias being shown by certain responses that illustrate this is about more than the actions of one and about a group. That line of thinking is just as detrimental and masks the issue. The core of this is about the people involved, so let’s please not lose focus of that.
I’ve been in Second Life more than I care to admit and surfing for almost as long as I’ve been around. I have personally witnessed behavior unbecoming of individuals no matter their affiliation. This ranges from inappropriate comments about higher scores for exposing themselves to just blatant unwanted advances. We must all endeavor to be better people, to be above this.
We are all people. Part of being human is mistakes and failure. That is the human experience. We are all flawed including me. Treat everyone with love and compassion knowing that everyone is struggling here.
In response to Shi.
You said:
'this should have remained between the individuals involved themselves and taken further legally if so inclined and dealt with in the RL realm if the victim was so personally offended'
Firstly, victims, there are victims, not one victim, two who have given their names in the post, one more who has given her name in the comments.
Read my original post, it explains my reactions, why I didn't immediately respond entirely negatively. To surmise, I was confused because I thought he was a friend, a good guy, and I talked to him about it and accepted his apology and explanation and made the decision to let him off the hook, albeit unfriending him and blocking him in-world. It was only after I found out that he'd done this to others that I changed my opinion about my decision. I was offered the chance to tell my story, I took it and gave my name, not his name.
The clue is in the title of the post, it's part of a discussion about #metoo in virtual worlds. I'm sure he feels ashamed as he has to live with it, as I feel ashamed that I have to live with his actions. This is the perfect forum to tell my story, it happened in the SL surfing community, therefore it belongs here.
To Navy. Community is not a group of people hugging and throwing lovehearts (unfortunately) it is an evolving dynamic, it evolves through conflict, through disruption, and it never settles, it is a process. This is part of the process. If people learn from this that's great. I stand my my right as a member of a community to make my stand against actions which I believe need opposing. I too am happy for anyone to IM me in-world if they want to discuss this further, I don't seek conflict with anyone and if you read my piece and my comments you will see I am committed to the idea of the perpetrator owning his actions and helping himself to change.
He already apologised to me in September, then he did it again to others, so that apology was hollow then. I've had an apology from a sexual offender in RL, it was also hollow so forgive me if I choose not to trust in words, if he never does this again, that is a greater redemption for me, As I said in my original statement
'Have a word with yourself, man, your apologies are hollow but you should apologise to your past and future selves, to the women who matter in your life, you've fucked up the now, it's up to you to change.'
Do it man, I believe you can, I'll love you for it, but I'm not part of your story anymore.
I think this is my last comment...*bows at the applause.
There is hypocrisy here and it is acrid and palpable.
It's amazing how loving and kind folks can appear to be when they are sober...not remembering the monsters they frequently become when they are drunk and despicable.
Aloha,
JT
Thank you to everyone who has supported the #metoo movement.. Everyone has an opinion and no opinion is right or wrong as it is opinions.. I would like to state that I do think if you are brave enough to send indecent pictures like the one in this article then why you should you feel offended or appalled that they are posted here? If you are this person's friend why are you so offended by seeing them but are you not offended by your friend's acts? I'm offended that he even thought this to be cute or funny, so if that's what that was then why should you be upset about it... He had no problem sharing this picture as if that was okay in the first place. I understand you want to stand by your friend and support him and possibly argue that "poor guy he feels bad now", but this is not the first time he has done this. It has been ongoing for years, so please don't sugar coat his shit, it looks bad. Secondly my friend was harassed by his friends when she tried to to bring this to others attention, so please you whoever was involved in that should be ashamed of themselves just as much as this guy sending the pic. I really don't care to see anyone's dick pic. Not only should this guy apologize, but whoever his friends were that were harassing my friend because she took a stand against this need to apologize as well because in my opinion you're just as bad as him... Being a true friend is telling your friend the truth, good or bad, not just covering his actions when he is finally caught. His actions were uncalled for and sick.
Selene Aruba.
That is your choice Kanjana, and if you feel its the perfect forum, that is also your right.
It was in my opinion that I thought it was wrong. We all have the right to choose. You do not need to defend your actions to me. I just offered up my opinion like everyone else has.
I do not need to defend my opinion either. Sexual abuse and harassment is different for everyone. I know I have been there and not just some simple dick pics on the net wanted or not. If i had a dollar for every dick picture that i had received without asking or wanted. I would be a bloody millionaire. It is your choice to not be in this medium, you can leave anytime and not come back, if this has so damaged your sensibilities.
Sexual abuse and harassment is horrid and a nightmare for any woman who has lived it. I know! NO means NO. People misjudge actions and words spoken even in voice let alone text. There is room for so much error and yes repeated behavior is a sign that there is something wrong. I am not condoning his behavior, but I will be there to help him see the damage he has done or caused. People F**K up.. simple as that.
There is help out there if you have been hurt and i would personally recommend getting it, because there is no way I would have got through it, if I had not sought help.
I just believe we can all be better people no matter who we are or what we believe or what opinion we hold..
I have been around SL long enough and seen enough people do wrong including myself more than once. So being a friend to someone who needs help, without judgement is all I can do.
Shi
Kanjena, I think we agree and are just saying things differently. I haven't mentioned hugging or throwing love hearts and fully understand that would be an idealistic concept.
Phew.....let´s see
To Chip´s Bodyguard: I aplogise for using the Word "enabler" Again, I just don´t understand how people can defend the actions of men like this......
but, after hearing the Word "Compassion" used by a few of his friends I can....sorta understand. For me personally though, compassion resides on the same street as respect and it is a 2 way street.
To Kan and Selene: I´m sorry for letting my personal dislike of this ONE person cloud the bigger Picture. There are millions of woman around the World (in the bigger Picture) that endure these kinds of transgressions and to them all my deepest respect.
To his friends in general: It´s up tou you guys, the friends that have yet to get a glimpse of his darker side to help him out. The folks that he has shown constant disrespect will have a MUCH harder time showing him compassion. Try to understand that.
I´ll be the first to admit that I bork things up sometimes. I have no problem saying I´m sorry. What I struggle with is finding compassion for those that have none of their own. At least none for me.
In any case...thanks and good Mojo to Kan and Selene for having the courage to make us all reflect and...argue. Without your testimony these things could have continued in our Little slice of SL. Hopefully they will not.
/V
Shi, thanks for your personal recommendation, honestly, I'm doing fine.
Do take the time to read all the comments here, I've commented thoroughly and in depth and have mentioned my own Real Life experience of sexual harassment, abuse and assault, I'm in full control of this scenario and am not looking for help or therapy, it's really beyond being about me.
In fact this has grown into something much bigger than the original intent, that's the beauty of reasoned discussion amid protest, it can become a revolution. Therefore the decision to share my story is vindicated by what it has triggered. This article will stand as an important moment in the discussion of harassment and abuse in virtual worlds.
As I said, community is an evolving dynamic, in that dynamic it is important for voices to be heard. Rather than 'defending my actions' I'm responding to a fallacy in your own stated opinion, the singular use of victim, there are three named here and I believe there are more who have come forward but so far remain anonymous. I have no problem with you stating your opinion but I will call out any untruth in that. By saying victim as a singular you put the emphasis on me alone, as I am the only 'victim' who has commented here.
It is my opinion that some of your comments come from fear, this is your avatar speaking not a human being and they dehumanise me with passive aggression. I do understand and I sympathise, I don't expect anything more or less. I'm well versed in the analysis of systems of abuse and the understanding of the fear of speaking out in a way that would damage one's position in a dependent social alliance.
There is a classic line which is 'I don't condone this, but' which is akin to 'I am not racist, but' and similar antithetical statements, which are always used to excuse the actions of an aggressor.
I'm also certain that if this same scenario had happened to you, to a close friend, a relative, to your child, you would feel very differently than if it had happened in a virtual world to someone you don't know and can therefore treat as less than human.
Saying all that, I do believe that you sincerely want to help your friend and I hope it works out, good luck.
Navy. Yes it was me who said about hugging and love-hearts, excuse me if it seemed as if I was attributing that ideal to your words, I'd hoped that by putting 'unfortunately' it would convey that I wasn't quoting you, I should have made that clearer.
"I do not need to defend my opinion either. Sexual abuse and harassment is different for everyone. I know I have been there and not just some simple dick pics on the net wanted or not. If i had a dollar for every dick picture that i had received without asking or wanted. I would be a bloody millionaire. It is your choice to not be in this medium, you can leave anytime and not come back, if this has so damaged your sensibilities"
This is absolutely brilliant. We've been looking at this all wrong. We don't need to actually address the offending behavior at all. If you are being abused, all you need to do is avoid every situation where it could occur. It's up to you, the victim, to know what's coming, and to simply stay away from it. Also, even though I admit sexual abuse and harassment is different for everyone, this particular behavior should not be so offensive to you because it isn't to me. Obviously your sensibilities are damaged.
That's it, everyone. You can all go home now and lock yourselves in your little rooms with no human contact whatsoever, because this is the correct way to deal with being abused or offended. Or, better yet, you can just choose to not feel abused or offended...well, unless you have damaged sensibilities.
So in short, we should have an abundance of compassion and understanding for the offender, and not so much for the victims. I'm so glad reason and common sense are alive and well. My faith in humanity is restored.
Thank you all for reading SurfWatch and taking the time to comment. Almost everything I was going to mention has already been addressed much better than I could, and I won't rehash points already covered except for two items I want to clarify:
1. SurfWatch's mission statement states we cover "...things of interest to the surfing community...". This qualifies. We are not defined by anyone else's parameters of what "SurfWatch" is allowed to cover.
2. After our #metoo follow up in September, myself, staff and SurfWatch were defamed as liars and other denigrating comments in private IM, in-world chat, in private FB IM, and on the SLSA FB page. I believe this perpetrator would have continued to call us liars had we not posted absolute proof with the graphic pictures. Although the photos were masked to hide his identity and genitals to the general public, he knew that we had the unmasked photos and could prove it was him. I believe that is the ONLY reason he admitted what he was doing.
This isn't about hate. When I first heard complaints of SL harassment and complaints of SL assault back in July, it made no sense to me. I had a loved one in RL that had been assaulted, and I saw first-hand the devastation that continued for years. That sparked the original question of does this actually exist in virtuality? It wasn't until I spoke to experts, did the research and heard from victims that I began to gain an understanding of how this impacts the women affected. The two incredibly brave women that stepped up to share their stories and many of the thoughtful and insightful comments left by readers have greatly added to my understanding, and for increasing my awareness and sensitivity to this issue, I will forever be grateful.
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